Podcast Episode

John Mesko: (00:22)
Hi, I'm John Mesko. And welcome to another edition of the People of Soil Health. Today's guest is Keith Byerly, SHP Field Manager for Nebraska and Kansas – and I know we won't have enough time to get to everything that Keith is contributing to the discussion around soil health and the efforts that he leads in Nebraska and Kansas. Keith graduated with a degree in agronomy from the University of Nebraska–Lincoln, and has been a Certified Crop Advisor for almost 20 years. He spent 18 years working for a cooperative of Nebraska and for 15 years was the Precision Ag Manager focusing on data services, prescriptions, and hardware before he joined the Soil Health Partnership in 2019. Welcome Keith.

Keith Byerly: (01:15)
Hi, John. Good to be here.

John Mesko: (01:17)
First off, tell us what it was like for you to transition from the commercial side of being with farmers every day and serving their needs from an input side of things, looking at how to support them with what they need to put their crops out to coming over to soil health and specifically the Soil Health Partnership, which is pretty much a non-profit organization.

John Mesko: (01:43)
We work with various funders to bring about a change in practices across a broad scale of producers, and that's a different approach. And tell me what it was like for you as you made that transition.

Keith Byerly: (01:56)
Well, surprisingly, it really wasn't as big of a jump as I expected it to be. I mean, when you're in the agronomy input business, when you're in the ag retail side of the world – and precision ag is no different than fertilizer or seed or any of those other things – as far as being a trusted advisor on the grower's farm, you're working on a relationship with those growers because that's where it all starts and stops, and having a good relationship is paramount to success in that role. And when we talk about soil health and helping our growers through the processes of adapting management practices on their farms, keeping the data flows going, all of the things that we do on a day-in and day-out basis with our growers, it's all about the relationships there as well. So I was lucky enough to get to work in the area where I've spent most of my life. I actually knew more than a handful of the growers that I work with on a day-in and day-out basis here at the Soil Health Partnership so the transition, really honestly, was pretty easy to me – just learning a little bit of a new language.

John Mesko: (03:02)
Well, that's great. And I know we're very happy to have you on our team and certainly are benefiting from your expertise and your experience in this area. And one of the things that we've relied on you and that you brought to us is a real strong emphasis and understanding around the data that is supported by yield monitors and the electronic recording of what goes on in a field over the course of a year. Recently, you said at a field day that sometimes the best story we have to tell about soil health is the lack of a story. And I'm curious how that ties in with some of your experience and what you meant by that.

Keith Byerly: (03:46)
Well, I think where that comes from is that a lot of times we've got two different bins of growers out there that are engaging in soil health practices. We've got the group that is inherently out there looking for the benefits. They're looking not only for the yield benefits, but for what it can do in their weed control, what it can do in their soil, health and bacteria and earthworms and all of those various aspects that we want to measure. And then we've got another group out there that's engaging in soil health because it's, for lack of a better way of saying it, it's checking a box, whether they've got something on their CSP contracts or something like that, that they have to engage in a soil health practice out there, they're doing it to fulfill a need that they have on their operation. And the first passing grade that it gets for them is if it doesn't take away yield, if it doesn't make the system more complicated or more costly for them.

Keith Byerly: (04:49)
So a lot of times when we're engaging new growers that aren't part of the Soil Health Partnership or coming to a field day or something along those lines, they're just looking for that first layer of reassurance that it's not going to end up being a line item expense on their operation. It's at least going to be something that generates its own revenue and keeps them neutral so that they can afford to do it and learn as they go.

John Mesko: (05:17)
Well, absolutely. And we've seen that over the course of our work at SHP and yield is something that obviously is very important to producers. It's something that they get to evaluate one time a year, that information gets recorded just at harvest. There's all kinds of things going on throughout the year that impact that – rainfall multiple times a year, hopefully, costs associated with input costs, chemical applications, or fuel purchases – all these other things that impact profitability happen multiple times a year. But we just have one chance a year to record yield. And that means that it's important for farmers to get the most accurate information out of their yield model. And I know you've got a lot of experience thinking that through and helping growers. What should producers keep in mind about yield monitors in general and how does it impact how they view their yield and ultimately their profitability?

Keith Byerly: (06:20)
Well, I think that there's not a grower out there that would go to the field and not have checked and changed fluids on their combines, inspected flightings on augers. All of those wear parts that are on all of those different machines that are part of their harvest operation, growers check before they go to the field because they don't want to start off with breakdowns. And all too often, we take these electronic components, these electronic systems – like a yield monitor system – for granted that they're just going to be ready to go because they worked when we parked them last year. And we have to remember that a yield monitor system, in particular, is made up of several wearable components, whether it's that impact plate that's attached to the load cell that measures the flow, or it's the components inside of our moisture sensor, or even the battery cables that run back to the battery.

Keith Byerly: (07:16)
All of those things are subject to wear and tear during a harvest season, they're subject to insects and rodents and things like that while the machine's stored for the winter and, in the case of battery cables, corrosion with time and an exposure to the elements. So we have to remember to check those things. We have to remember to take care of the wear parts on those yield monitor systems, because like you said, there's not a do-over on getting this data. If we mess up, say, planting severely enough, we can go out there and hit a reset button and plant a crop over. Expensive, yes, but possible as well. There's never another chance to reacquire, like you said, all those variables that went into making this year's yield and getting those recorded. So on top of all of that, a grower has also got to be mindful that their data structure on that monitor matches the way that it was planted.

Keith Byerly: (08:15)
It makes sense, old data was cleaned off of the monitor so that they're not overlapping from your prior. And then if that's not enough, we also have to be mindful of how our data is leaving the field. You know, every salesman that travels to a grower's operation would love to get their hands on that yield data so they can run it through their systems and produce a map for that grower that goes along with their seed proposal or their fertilizer proposal or whatever they might be doing. But sometimes when that data is copied or downloaded off of a monitor, it may present an opportunity for that data to be lost for the grower's other interests in getting that data. So just a number of different things there as we go along to make sure that we are mindful and we check our boxes and know who's downloaded it, who's got copies, that we maintain the system and that we're ready to go when we start on day number one.

John Mesko: (09:20)
Well, I think you bring up some good points about how interesting data is to various parties and entities. Of course, data is very important to the Soil Health Partnership, but it's important to many other folks that are out there working to support farmers and advance some of their own ideas about what farmers should be doing in their fields. Data is extremely valuable. I think when I think back to the beginning of my career in agronomy, data, like what we're talking about here, is fairly new. Most of the time prior to that data was just something somebody recorded off of a weigh wagon or some weigh pads in the field. But this type of data, which is in real time, which varies across the field where you can identify hotspots and cold spots in the field and prescribe a response to those things is extremely valuable. And I agree with you, farmers and everyone who's working with this really needs to pay attention to the accuracy and the privacy and the security of that data.

Keith Byerly: (10:27)
Without that data, time tends to gloss over the differences that we see out in the field. If I don't have that data down in black and white or digital on my computer to remind me of, I got this difference from this set of inputs and management practices, by the time I get around to the next planting season or the next harvest season, my mind has kind of glossed over everything, unless it was a really, really big difference. And I'm back down to, oh, they were about the same, and about the same doesn't help drive decisions.

John Mesko: (11:02)
Right. Absolutely. Well, along with this, I mean, we talk about data, but really it's part of precision ag. And I know you've got many stories related to your experience in precision ag. And what kind of examples can you share about data systems that should be monitored?

Keith Byerly: (11:21)
It's happened so many times that the story has kind of become generic in my mind, but the number of times that I've gotten a phone call from a grower during harvest that says, "Hey, my GPS isn't working. I don't have ground speed. My mapping system's not making a map on my screen. I've lost the system. What can I do?" And you go through a handful of questions and ultimately you don't quite figure it out over the phone the right way, only to drive out to the field and figure out that they just started opening a brand new field and they'd wiped the GPS antenna off of the combine with a tree branch while they were going around the borders. And it seems like such a simple thing to have avoided. I mean, all you have to do is get outside of that combine and do one walk around and you would have found that antenna getting knocked off, but it's a perfect testament to how much tunnel vision we all get when we get into harvest mode, particularly.

Keith Byerly: (12:22)
I know I'm no different when I get that tunnel vision and don't necessarily take the time to logically think through my troubleshooting process and figure out why something isn't working. I just know that it's not working. I've got a phone number and I want it to work now. And I think it's a great testament to all of us to remind us that when something isn't working, take that 60 seconds, separate yourself from the situation and think about what we can do to fix it, what might be the problem. Because a lot of times when it comes to yield monitor systems, it's very simple things that fail. It's a blown fuse. It's an antenna that's got knocked off. It's a corn stock that jammed itself somewhere it shouldn't be. And instead of relying on somebody to come do a service call and be there to fix it in an hour or two hours and lose that data over that time, we can figure it out if we'll just take a few seconds to slow down and look.

John Mesko: (13:26)
All right, Keith, the audience for this podcast includes people from all walks of agriculture. And there's probably a few listening here who may not completely understand the details about how we get [data] from the monitor in a combine, that the different components that make up the monitor of a combine, to an actual number of bushels per acre, on a spreadsheet or in a data set that comes out of that combine. Can you give us a quick tutorial on how yield in a combine is figured, how yield is figured by a monitor in a combine?

Keith Byerly: (14:03)
Sure. So it really comes down to being as simple as three components at the base of making it happen. So component number one, I need a speed source – whether that comes from the wheels, whether that comes from a radar, whether that comes from a GPS antenna – I have to have a speed source to go into that because speed times with my machine over time determines how much area I've covered. So area, you can't have bushels per acre, if you don't know how many acres there are. So speed is that first component. Component number two is our elevator speed sensor on that combine because knowing that the machine is engaged and knowing how fast that combine is going to be throwing grain at our third component, which is a flow sensor or a scale pad in there tells us how much to multiply that weight that comes from that load cell by to get the bushels per minute or the pounds per minute, to determine all of that other stuff. Then you can add on things like moisture, like your GPS position to create a map and all of these other pieces to it, to make it more valuable or make it more spatial. But at the heart of it, it's distance. It's flowing in pounds per second against a load cell. And it's how fast it's storing that grain against the load cell that creates the basis of a yield map.

John Mesko: (15:41)
Well, that's very helpful. And as we think about this, an awful lot of data is coming together to form that yield map or that yield report that we have coming off a field. What can be done by the producer or folks that are working in this to avoid a potential data loss?

Keith Byerly: (16:00)
Well, I think first of all, always remember the conditions that we're harvesting in because windy conditions may make harvest more difficult, but they don't necessarily affect yield, but wet conditions and cold conditions certainly can affect the way that the yield goes along. The way that we're harvesting our crop, or I guess I should say the environmental factors that lead to how the crop is laying out in the field, have a lot to do with it as well. A good standing crop that flows more pounds per second into the combine or more pounds permitted into that combine is going to require your yield monitor to be calibrated in a certain way. Whereas unfortunately this year across the Midwest where we had the derecho and we've got down corn, that combine is going to be going slower through the field and have lower flow per second, that is going to require it to be set up slightly differently.

Keith Byerly: (17:04)
And with all of those conditions, you have to be mindful of the amount of dirt that your combine's pulling in, whether it's soybeans or corn, if you're getting an excessive amount of dirt into that combine, you have to make sure that those wearable parts are kept clean so the grain flows through properly, that your moisture measures properly and things like that along the way as you go. There's a hundred different scenarios that I can think that play out in any given year. The fact of the matter is, though, that you just want to keep your combine calibrated properly for the speed and the flow or the yield that you're working in. And that if I go from 280 bushel irrigated corn to 70 bushel dry land corn, my combine is going to have grain going through it at a different rate. And it may require that I calibrate it differently to accept that different rate of corn coming in per hour.

John Mesko: (18:08)
Yeah, that's an excellent point. And as you mentioned, we may have yields like that are worse than some of those areas where the corn is down right now. Obviously you work in Nebraska and Kansas and I know that you've got a lot of experience with the irrigation. I was recently out there myself in Nebraska, and I learned a lot about irrigation. As an eastern corn belt, central corn belt, long-time resident and working there, I have not experienced irrigation in the ways that you folks do out there. Let's talk about irrigation and tell me why you're so passionate about irrigation and how you think soil health can impact water management.

Keith Byerly: (18:51)
Well, irrigation is so important to me because Nebraska has 15% of the irrigation ground in the United States, which is the number one state in irrigation. If you expand that out a little bit, about 20% of all the corn, cotton, and wheat grown in the US is grown on land that's fed by the Ogallala aquifer, which is what we set above here in Nebraska. And we may pull our water out of an aquifer that sets above it, but that's our underlying aquifer here for a good chunk of the western corn belt. Water is becoming more and more of a social issue as we go on on year in and year out, whether it's the amount of water that's in the lake when somebody wants to go spend July 4th weekend out there, or it's how much is flowing down the Platte River when they cross the bridge going from Lincoln to Omaha, or it's the flood state of the Missouri for what seemed like two and a half years here in recent history, it's such a visible social issue.

Keith Byerly: (20:09)
And so much emphasis is put on maintaining the level of our aquifers, as well as maintaining the quality of the water that we see going down the rivers. There's no doubt that, say, the Big Blue River, the Little Blue River here in Nebraska, doesn't flow blue very often anymore. It's almost always a brown color to it because we don't have our erosion taken care of across a large area. And as climate has become a little less predictable and thunderstorms definitely carry higher volumes of rain than they used to, we just can't take it into our soil at a rapid enough rate. And therein lies the impact and the importance of soil health in this whole conversation about irrigation. That water-holding capacity of the soil, whether it's irrigated or not, is the number one yield limiting factor. When you travel west of the Missouri River anywhere across this country. That goes back to soil health, about what our infiltration rates look like, how healthy of a soil we have, what that pore space looks like for absorbing that water in and holding water for those long dry periods we get.

Keith Byerly: (21:33)
And it's exactly the same story that that water infiltration rate and improving that water infiltration rate means that less water runs off the surfaces of our fields and ends up going down those creeks and rivers and carrying whatever they've come in contact with as they've gained their head going into those rivers. And if we have less water flowing to those creeks and rivers, we have less soil, we have less corn stalks and all of those things floating down those waterways. And because most of those waterways are spring-fed, at least in Nebraska, it's not going to decrease the amount of water that's going down the rivers, it's just going to improve the water quality, having it filtered by this wonderful sponge that we set on that goes down to the aquifers.

John Mesko: (22:27)
So Keith, you've been working now with the Soil Health Partnership for a little over a year and have been really trying some of these things that we've been talking about together. We've been talking about the information around the importance of soil health and water management for the area that you work in, in Kansas and Nebraska. We've been talking about the importance of monitoring and managing yield data so that we have good, accurate information with which we can use to make decisions. We've been talking about how those decisions can lead to farmers making a change in production practices, which may or may not impact yield right away. And hopefully we can see yields stay consistent and soils improve over time. What has been, in the last year or so since you've been working in this area, what has been or have been some of the most surprising takeaways?

Keith Byerly: (23:23)
Well, I think that probably the most surprising takeaway has been that coming from the ag retail world, being a sales agronomist, or being in the sales agronomist world of ag retail, that there is so much more happening out on our growers farms than we realize as their consulting agronomist. The efforts that they're undertaking in the world of soil health, the interactions that they are having with Extension people and the time and money that some of our growers are spending to go to workshops, to engage with the soil health rockstars that are out there and be students of what's going on and implement it on their own was somewhat mind-blowing when you got to peek behind the curtain and see what was happening. I think that is easily the biggest thing that has surprised me as I have made this transition is that there is so much effort going on, on a grower's part, that they don't necessarily share with their other trusted advisors in their operation.

Keith Byerly: (24:44)
And maybe that means that I wasn't at the level of trusted advisor that I thought I was with them. Maybe that means I wasn't asking the right questions, or maybe growers just view it as two completely different worlds. There's the production side of this and then there's the conservation side of this and they don't see them crossing. But the potential to maximize efforts all the way around the farm, if the communication was there to loop everybody in on the efforts and know what the goals were beyond the production, but know the rest of the farm’s goals would certainly have helped me in the retail world to be more succinct and more focused on the right kind of success for these growers.

John Mesko: (25:36)
That's really interesting, a very interesting point that you make there. And I think that's probably true with a lot of farmers, that they do think of the circles that they work in as somewhat distinct. I have this group of people that I'm concerned about understanding what they have for me with regard to pesticides or fertilizers. And I have this group of people that are helping me understand cover crops. And I think partly is that not any one person has all the advice and maybe that's part of it too.

Keith Byerly: (26:13)
Yeah, I think that's definitely the case is a lot of times these growers, they have their silos and they don't think, and I shouldn't just say growers, the agronomists that work with them are no different. I think all of us kind of build our silos and we don't think that anything needs to travel between the two.

John Mesko: (26:33)
Yeah. I think that's true. Well, and that's very much like the way I've used soil health, Keith. And that is that it's something that brings together all the components that go into making a crop, everything from water to fertility, to pesticides, to organic matter, erosion. And all these things kind of center around a particular soil's health and its ability to process the natural systems that are in place there. And you've said, and I've heard you say that, soil health is not just one thing, it's about 40 different things. And so how do you recommend for growers to prioritize the handful of things that should matter to them out of all the other factors and components of soil health?

Keith Byerly: (27:19)
I think it's really easy for us to help growers find out what they want or need to prioritize. I've never met a grower that didn't have legacy on their mind when it came to their operations. They're always concerned about making the right choices for that operation. That means that their children or their grandchildren, or that next person in line for that operation has the ability to take it over, that it's a viable operation, and in a hundred years from now, it's out there still a thing and being recognized by the county or the state at the fair or at a reception for being a legacy operation that's been around a long time. That legacy, in a lot of cases, will tell a grower what their driving force is, especially early on in their adoption of soil health. If they've got hilly ground, they know that they want to do something to curtail the amount of runoff that they have, they want to contain any erosion they have, things like that. It's not hard to figure that out.

Keith Byerly: (28:27)
If they're like me and they're in the drier western portions of our country, they know that water infiltration is the most important thing that they need to deal with. If they can store two or three more inches of water per growing season in their farm, that's $30 that they save per acre in irrigation costs are that's three more inches, that's another 15 or 20 bushel on that dry land crop out there that they can build by going after the lowest hanging fruit and that passion, what's important for them to ensure their legacy is what's going to drive their commitment to their soil health journey. You can't incentivize or force the commitment if they're not passionate about it. So help them figure out what that legacy dictates for their operation and drive that as their passion.

John Mesko: (29:24)
Yeah. That's a good point. What is the most important yes, that is out there. It makes it a lot easier to say no, or make decisions about other components. And I think that's good advice. Lastly, Keith, we would be remiss if we didn't mention the importance of wheat to the area that you work in, particularly in the Kansas area. And I know we've been working on a project at SHP with wheat growers. Can you tell us about that a little bit and what the wheat industry is looking to gain from working with SHP trials?

Keith Byerly: (30:00)
So, first and foremost, I think it's important that everyone understands that even though we may be working with a more diverse rotation, a rotation that involves wheat or growers that have wheat as their primary crop on their operation, instead of corn and or soybeans, it doesn't mean that we at Soil Health Partnership are doing something different. In all of these cases, we're doing the same research with these growers that we're doing on the other hundred sites that we have with corn and soybean growers out there. We're looking at the same factors. We're measuring things in a very similar manner. The timing might be different. The practices might be different, but the principles are all the same. And it's really important to us, and all of our growers that don't have wheat on the operation, because this is the window that lets us see into those more diverse crop rotations.

Keith Byerly: (31:02)
What happens when we add a third or a fourth crop to that? How does the climate that they operate in and the environmental challenges that they have shake up how they manage weed control challenges and weed control operations that they have. How does growing a crop in a different window out of the year, change up all of the micro life that lives in our soils and keep them active at different times or put them into hibernation at little bit different times. So I think really when it comes down to it, how do the practices fit with the crops and timing? That is an incredibly important piece that the wheat industry is looking for when they engage with Soil Health Partnership on this research on-farm. Do the practices fit and how do we go about incorporating cover crops in with the timing of our rotations and the weed control operations and the actual cover crops or the crops that we include in those species? How do we incorporate more no-till into areas that have grasses and weeds that don't respond to herbicides anymore? That's number one.

Keith Byerly: (32:23)
Number two is something completely different though, from what we do day-in and day-out – and that is the grain quality itself. Wheat seems to have a shorter path to the grocery store shelves than corn and soybeans do in many instances. It's a matter of milling it and it's in flour and in so many of our products and wheat growers are often interested in concerned in growing nutrient dense foods that have better dough qualities, things like that, because they want to see if improved farming practices, improved soil health will drive better quality products to the market that they can in turn, receive a better price for, receive the benefits of providing a better product to the consumer.

Keith Byerly: (33:14)
And then I think probably the third thing is understanding the benefits of having that wheat in the rotation, which is a little bit different than talking about the crops and the timing, because I kind of alluded to it before. It's that break in the cycles that we get with two or three crops for our corn and soybean growers. It's that opportunity to do more photosynthesis throughout the entirety of the year by having a crop that stays green after the first frost and is greening up while we're still getting very cold nights in the spring and creating that photosynthesis. But that is another incredibly important part that's a little bit different than just the cover crops we use out of this. So it really is a symbiotic relationship with our wheat growers here for us at SHP, because we get to take that knowledge that we get from our base crops, the corn and soybeans, across the good portion of the corn belt and see how it fits into those rotations. But at the same time, we get to see all those extra benefits of different growing cycles out of the year and a more diverse crop rotation.

John Mesko: (34:27)
I think that's well said. We work all across the corn belt and then as we get into the...it's not only differences in east and west, but north and south as well. And so when we move north and we have a shorter growing season, how do we get those cover crops established? And I think what we learn in some of the wheat areas gives us an insight and some assistance in helping us learn what we can do in other parts of the country as well. All right. Well, thank you, Keith, for the opportunity to hear a little bit about your interest in soil health and irrigation and data and how we can use some of these resources to learn more about what's going on on-farm. Certainly appreciate all that you're doing for the Soil Health Partnership. We're very glad to have you on our team and looking forward to some of the insights that you continue to uncover there.

Keith Byerly: (35:20)
Thanks, John. I think, if I had a parting thought from this conversation today, it would just simply be to say to growers, agronomists, everyone that's part of what goes on out at the farm that it's to remember that even though we may approach our tasks on a day-to-day basis differently, we may have different jobs that go on through the course of each and every day, the same as our brothers and sisters that grow wheat as a primary crop or grain sorghum or whatever it is, we all do things a little bit differently, but it's through that communication, it's through engaging your peers and talking, not just across the fence, but talking across the state and finding those digital ways to engage with people right now that lead to revelations in how to practice differently what you're doing and find these opportunities to engage in and find new successes for your operation.

John Mesko: (36:26)
Well said, Keith, and I think that makes a great advertisement for the Soil Health Partnership, what we're doing and how we hope to share these learnings across the community. Thank you again for your time. I appreciate you very much, and we'll look forward to talking again.

Keith Byerly: (36:40)
Thanks, John.